Sigh. Check. Fold.

[Pates]

Is this the move you'd make against a known LP preflop lag player? I know he raises all sorts of rag aces and pocket pairs. This guy is a serious douche from previous hands.

So do we check fold? Or do we just close our eyes and shove. I never expect my 4-bets to be called so I didn't have time to close my eyes and push. Who calls 4-bets with 100bb stacks? Sobad

Thoughts please.

[bizkit]

So he's raising with a typically good range of hands to do so with from LP. What does playing like a serious douche mean? lol. If we're checking folding here when we have like AA or AK we have to check a two suited board as well.

[Pates]

So he's raising with a typically good range of hands to do so with from LP. What does playing like a serious douche mean? lol. If we're checking folding here when we have like AA or AK we have to check a two suited board as well.

My point is that he doesn't raise with a particularly good set of hands. I know he can 3-bet all the time with A6 etc. He did smooth call my 4-bet which just stinks of weakness (AK would clearly want to get it in here). So should I lead out and hope he doesn't have an A or check to him and then let him bluff or bet his paired ace?

I don't get your point about folding AA or AK. I don't think anyone folds either on that flop HU.

[The Incompetent-Donkey]

So he's raising with a typically good range of hands to do so with from LP. What does playing like a serious douche mean? lol. If we're checking folding here when we have like AA or AK we have to check a two suited board as well.

My point is that he doesn't raise with a particularly good set of hands. I know he can 3-bet all the time with A6 etc. He did smooth call my 4-bet which just stinks of weakness (AK would clearly want to get it in here). So should I lead out and hope he doesn't have an A or check to him and then let him bluff or bet his paired ace?

I don't get your point about folding AA or AK. I don't think anyone folds either on that flop HU.

I might just push every flop with all my value range, solves the problem whether he has it or not.

[nickstrick1]

Maybe AK off suit wouldn't want to get it in there pre, he's pretty deep.

Its a good ch-fold imo for the record. Had he made moves like this before though?

+ not so sure on the bet sizing. +10 in that spot as a 4bet is kind of asking for a smooth call. Not sure the right amount to bet though, I'd want to make him pay more pre if i'm oop, maybe up to like $22. looks uber strong and he will fold out AK?

[Pates]

I might just push every flop with all my value range, solves the problem whether he has it or not.

With this logic - check/calling is best. By checking you open it up to bluffs where KK is actually ahead.

@Strick

He still has effective 100bbs. The pot button is dodgy on RedStar, it usually under estimates the pot (as if computer software can't just get the pot number right..) so I usually pot and add a few bbs extra which is what I did. You're right, I probably wouldn't go as far as $22 but a bit more than $10+ wld've helped. With 10 tables up, making sure I'm potting it can be difficult.

[The Incompetent-Donkey]

With this logic - check/calling is best. By checking you open it up to bluffs where KK is actually ahead.

You've got over 30% of your stack in pre, and if he checks behind that sucks aswell. You're pot commited and are better of pushing QQ's than c/cing them.

Checking turns our hand pretty much face up and you will find that he might just bet with Ax. So I prefer c/f to c/c.

shove>c/f>c/c reasoning is that if villain was willing to call a 1/3rd of his stack on a 1/6 chance I dont mind paying him off.

[Pates]

You've got over 30% of your stack in pre, and if he checks behind that sucks aswell. You're pot commited and are better of pushing QQ's than c/cing them.

Checking turns our hand pretty much face up and you will find that he might just bet with Ax. So I prefer c/f to c/c.

shove>c/f>c/c reasoning is that if villain was willing to call a 1/3rd of his stack on a 1/6 chance I dont mind paying him off.

I think you missed my point. By check/calling here every time we are getting the most value out of the hand. If he (bluff) shoves JJ or less then we're getting value from this hand which otherwise would've folded if we shove UTG. So by check calling we're getting it all in with QQ vs bluff and QQ vs AK rather than shoving where we only get it all in with QQ vs AK (or any other hand that beats us). This was just in reply to your post about pushing UTG.

If villain checks behind we can be pretty certain he didn't spike the ace. A check behind either means a set or air imo. If when you say that checking turns our hand face up, I'm not sure how it can do this if we choose check call option with AK/KK/QQ every time.

This is one situation where we can actually check/call 100% of the time to make this profitable whilst not exposing any tells.

[Gerrard48LFC]

I think you missed my point. By check/calling here every time we are getting the most value out of the hand. If he (bluff) shoves JJ or less then we're getting value from this hand which otherwise would've folded if we shove UTG. So by check calling we're getting it all in with QQ vs bluff and QQ vs AK rather than shoving where we only get it all in with QQ vs AK (or any other hand that beats us). This was just in reply to your post about pushing UTG.

If villain checks behind we can be pretty certain he didn't spike the ace. A check behind either means a set or air imo. If when you say that checking turns our hand face up, I'm not sure how it can do this if we choose check call option with AK/KK/QQ every time.

This is one situation where we can actually check/call 100% of the time to make this profitable whilst not exposing any tells.

what he said.

[bizkit]

My point is that he doesn't raise with a particularly good set of hands. I know he can 3-bet all the time with A6 etc. He did smooth call my 4-bet which just stinks of weakness (AK would clearly want to get it in here). So should I lead out and hope he doesn't have an A or check to him and then let him bluff or bet his paired ace?

The bolded wasn't clear before because we were just talking about his raising range and generallyf rom a steal position not his re-raising range. Another thing that's unclear is how often and with what range you estimate he's firing out here when you check. If its wide enough this could potentially even be a check call/content going broke with QQ.

I don't get your point about folding AA or AK. I don't think anyone folds either on that flop HU.

My point is if you intend to check/fold this flop with QQ you have to check with the intention of calling or putting it in with your value hands like AA,AK & even possibly KK.